OpenStreetMap
Hello everyone,
some days ago I began to (try) improve the mapping of the US and in particular I’m focusing in the correction of the agricultural roads that are currently mapped with a wrong tag highway = residential.
My work does not touch other tags (in particular those related to the given TIGER) to allow the backup of the original data in case I make some very serious errors (also TIGER has many: wrong tag, wrong geometry, probably wrong names…so I have to put in effort to make the situation worse ).
Another thing that I try to do is reduce the number of unnecessary nodes (I saw very straight roads with hundreds on sorted nodes), which greatly complicates the workflow as it is easy to create conflict if my work touches streets with nodes outside the downloaded area (in JOSM).
Last point is the addition of a surface tag because not all the agricultural roads are equal and some of them, being paved, may allow the use as a useful shortcut and this is where I have a problem in distinguishing the material of the road.
For example, I can not understand what surface is that of this and many other agricultural roads.
Can you help me?
Thank you.
Discussion
Comment from lyx on 18 April 2015 at 09:02
This appears to be a track consisting of compressed earth. I would tag that as highway=track, tracktype=4 (might be 3). I usually don’t tag surface for tracks because it is hard to be sure from the aerial image, and the tracktype is sufficient to indicate quality.
Comment from lyx on 18 April 2015 at 09:06
correction: was supposed to be tracktype=grade4
Comment from Richard on 18 April 2015 at 09:48
Great to see someone else joining in the Herculean task of rural TIGER fixup.
I tend to take the attitude that guessing surfaces remotely is difficult, and that it’s more important to get broad-brush coverage sooner (so that we might one day have a usable map) rather than very detailed coverage of particular areas. So I usually choose one of:
highway=track- unpaved and ungradedhighway=unclassified,surface=unpaved- unpaved but gradedhighway=unclassified,surface=gravel- if the surface is apparent from the imageryhighway=unclassified- pavedhighway=tertiary- good quality paved with centrelinehighway=trackimplies unpaved so I don’t usually add surface/tracktype tags when working from imagery.Comment from jumbanho on 18 April 2015 at 12:34
I agree with Richard on the general classification scheme, though I have pointed out that sometimes rural unpaved roads can be residential as they basically serve residential farms. I grew up in an area where the great bulk of the roads were graded gravel and we used them with regular vehicles (including bicycles) as though they were part of the highway network
In examining the edits in the area linked to here, I think you have favored track over unclassified to too great a degree. The “County Road” X roads look well graded and should be unclassified. I would tend to only use track on highways in this area that are less than two lanes wide.
Comment from Aury88 on 18 April 2015 at 15:34
Hi lyx, I’m not expert in the use of the tracktype tag, but it seem to me another tag to use with the tag surface to specify its maintenance grade (it can be applied virtually to any type of surface, asphalt included), but I can not see it from the aerial image… The surface tag seem to me more appropriate for the thing I can see/distinguish from aerials
@Richard/jumbanho So in USA do you use highway=unclassified (+ surface=paved/unpaved/gravel) also for roads with predominant/only agricultural use?
I thought that even in the USA the surface material classification was made through the use of surface tags and the lanes number through the lanes tag; In Europe highway tag is based on the predominant use and traffic intensity not only based on the highway classification so I (wrongly) assumed that this mapping style can also be applied on USA.
Also there are already somehighway=unclassified on the TIGER import in rural areas so I (wrongly again ) assumed that roads were “unclassified” roads and residential ones (in rural areas) were of another kind of roadsand since there were no “track” I wrongly thought those were how TIGER classified track type roads…
So do you think I need to replace highway = truck (+ surface= gravel) with highway = unclassified + surface= gravel for all major agricultural roads (like the one linked in my diary)?
Comment from lyx on 18 April 2015 at 16:12
Well, the tracktype tag as I read the description is kind of a “summary” of the state of a track. The surface can be specified separately but is assumed to be unpaved except for tracktype=grade1. I would not use tracks with tracktype=grade3 or worse with a normal vehicle unless its the only way to reach my destination. I admit I had only looked at the western part of the way you linked originally; the eastern part I would classify tracktype=grade3. I also assume that road classification in the US is based on predominant use as it is in the rest of the world, other mappers may think different though. Personally I also don’t use highway=residential for small unpaved lanes connecting a single farm to the road network and instead tag these as highway=service, surface=unpaved (or surface=gravel if I can identify it from images).
Comment from maxerickson on 18 April 2015 at 16:56
The roads are not all agricultural access roads. The primary purpose of the adjacent land might be agricultural, but many of the roads are public and administrated by a public entity (likely the county) for the purpose of accessing the land in general.
From a US POV, this way is obviously unclassified:
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/13083011
If it has been recently graded, it would be suitable for driving 40+ mph in a sedan.
The one you link is less clear.
For the road I linked, it’s even unlikely that the predominant traffic is agricultural, as there would likely be regular car traffic and only occasional use for accessing the nearby fields.
Comment from Richard on 18 April 2015 at 17:24
@Aury88: I’m a European mapper, I’m just helping out in the US! But as maxerickson says, they’re not agricultural access roads - they’re just rural roads. You or I have every right to drive or cycle along them, and indeed I might consider them a pleasant cycling alternative to the busy main roads.
Comment from Aury88 on 18 April 2015 at 18:34
In Italy agricultural road are normaly freely accessible (if not private property).They are not so big like in USA but I think have the same purpose. We usually map them with highway=track if they are not generally used by people for normal travels…during the days normally these roads doesn’t see particular traffic except tractors, animals and farmers or fields workers but they can be used by everyone. the classification and the administrator/operator also doesn’t influence the tag…we can have regionals road with a lower level highway value than some provincial roads if they are minor for traffic purpose..it’s rare but can happen. For me there is not problem at all, if you say that those are unclassified roads I’ll map in that way ;)
I’ll try to use also the tracktype tag suggested by lyx.
@ maxerickson: yes, the linked road seem an unclassified road…probably I selected/see the north side where the normal traffic use seemed to me improbable…in this case do you is better to cut the road at the Westview Avenue intersection and tag the south block with unclassified/residential and north with track or do you think it’s better to make it all unclassified?
thank you all guys!
Comment from maxerickson on 18 April 2015 at 20:44
Yeah, that sounds about right to cut it there.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the northern section is really an unnamed private track (But that’s hard to tell).