Welcome back. I knew a man from Nigeria, in the US. He spoke highly of your country and he was a good man. I hope to visit some day. Happy mapping! -USA

@pedrito1414,

Take a look at changeset 56707640. It was also 4 years ago and the changeset comment looks like: “#hotosm-project-1318 , #Map4Tg , #ProjetEOF , @OSMTogo , #YunoMap”

That changeset has changes to 8265 ways. They look like they might all be v1. https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/56707640

@SimonPoole, we were comparing different numbers. It would be easier to correct this misunderstanding if we were in person. So, I’ll leave it there.

@Zverik, No one has a problem with MAPS.ME. It just didn’t produce many edits (36% of users and <0.1% of edits). This also isn’t a competition between MAPS.ME and JOSM. JOSM has 7-8% of all OSM users and produces 60% of all edits. One of these groups is objectively more valuable that the other. Being angry about this fact makes as much sense as being angry that the sun is bright or that mountains are tall. I’ll leave with, your description of OSM’s needs, verses , is not the impression I have ever seen expressed in the community and is the opposite of what I believe. I guess we agree about not being controlling. Anyway, thank you for all the work you’ve put in and the passion you bring to this project.

Some examples of “legitimate” bloat tags. I understand that these are subjective. ) “opening_hours:signed=” appears to have been created by you as a placeholder key and it only benefits Street Complete. Flags on data that are used for quality of life improvements in the app should be solved in the app. Regardless of my opinion, I am not going to fight over this. That’s 17,000 tags of SC using OSM’s database to store it’s data flags. *) “crossing:island=no” is a value that can assumed to be “no” instead of needing to apply it to every known crossing in OSM. I believe, I saw a post which says SC limits what types of streets it will place this tag on. I’m sure that helps but why is it placed at all? 353,000 (70%) unnecessary tags. The same thing applies to other tags like “tactile_paving=no”. Again, I don’t care enough to fight over it. check_date / survey:date / last_checked / etc. are all bloat tags. At best, they belong in “note” but I (and many others) don’t feel that the tags/note belongs in the database at all. It’s 1.4 million unnecessary tags.

“all affected data was repaired” I believe you folks made a solid attempt. Regardless, I have fixed and continue to fix some of these SC errors. As you know, SC v28.0 had an error with crossing/kerb tags. If it was a larger problem I would not know. I only noticed that it would remove all tags on barrier=kerb / tactile_paving=* nodes. I just noticed this error from SC v38.2. Changeset 115319560 (SC v38.1) added tactile_paving=yes to crossing node on 2021-Dec-23 [Node: 4291702901]. Nodes at each end of the footway=crossing have had tactile_paving=yes since 2017-Feb-26 [Way: 436979377] [Node: 4694343209] [Node: 4707439042]. Therefore, we now have double tagging and the crossing node should not have had the tactile_paving=* tag added. Not a huge deal but it can be frustrating. I have come across other issues from time to time but the crossing/kerb tags being deleted was the worst one that affected me. I would include more variety in errors but I can’t recall which nodes or ways had the other issues. Normally, the issues are minor so either I fix it or I ignore it and move on.

“mappers answering incorrectly” that can always be a frustration but we all make mistakes. I have seen folks, that have been mapping since 2008, make simple errors. I don’t blame SC for that type of issue.

“complicated situations” surface=* - Long ways that cross different surfaces (example: asphalt → paving stones → asphalt). It will get tagged with “asphalt” leaving the middle segment tagged wrong. I know that SC can do some edits like splitting a way. roof:shape=* on non-flat roofs. Roof shapes are often complicated and tagging a simple building outline results in a simple roof shape. Often, what should happen is a complicated building needs to be redrawn with building:part=* and each building:part=* gets the appropriate roof:shape=* tag. I’m sure there are plenty of better examples but my statement is more about the general idea that StreetComplete has expanded to include tags that are more complicated to add than they appear to be at first.

I just get frustrated with these issues from time to time but these are small problems. I love the idea of StreetComplete. I enjoy the look and feel of StreetComplete. I’m ok with the function of StreetComplete. I hate how well-meaning fans of the app keep pushing it to do more and to do everything. StreetComplete filled a great need. A very easy to use program that is error proof in adding tags. That is my opinion.

Mateusz Konieczny, I want to say, I appreciate how you handle criticism. I know you work on the wiki pages. It looks like on 2021-Feb-07 Victor.yarema incorrectly added “crossing=” node only tags as appropriate way tags (ID also has this error). I see “crossing=traffic_signals” and “crossing=marked”, “crossing_ref=zebra” added to the first two examples. Node: highway=crossing + crossing= Way: highway=footway/path/* + footway/*=crossing https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:footway%3Dcrossing&oldid=2106935

Thank you for the updates. I would never wish this to be required but I’d still love to see this become a practice of more OSMF board members (and work groups).

As a user, the biggest frustration I have had with the AI assisted mapping programs (project? output?) is the inability (or difficulty) in reporting false detection or detentions based on old map data. I do not know if this was an issue with your project. Another issue, though this is likely personality dependent, I can begin to feel forced to map what the AI has identified instead of feeling free to map what I wish to map while being assisted by the AI. The second issue is far less important.

I agree.

This looks very good. Nice work.

This topic sounds very interesting. I will happily give your videos a watch. Thank you.

I have never seen so many uniformed “building=yes” grids. They are all over that city. Such junk data and sadly with HOT hashtag.

Welcome, FourOh!

Glad to see you here. Whatever you do, take it slow. There is plenty to do and you could spend years just adding and correcting “emergency=fire_hydrant” (just an example). Due only what you are interested in and “leave the rest to God”.

If no one else has mentioned it yet, OSM US is a great group of people (if you’re into community). In a more solo angle, search “State of the Map” on YouTube for years of great conference videos, related to OSM. There are many project that I found out only through those videos.

JOSM is an equally powerful editor (yet opposite strengths in every way), check it out when and if you feel like it. Many people also use StreetComplete and/or Vespucci to edit on the move (Android). It looks like you are sticking to edits that you can personally survey. That is a wise move until you get your feet under you.

Again, it’s great to see you here. Good luck and Happy mapping!

Hello!! I hope all is well with you. - From Seattle, US.

“StreetComplete is still almost not noticeable by edited object volume” Oh, I notice it. My area has lost work because of a bug. It dumps “legitimate” tagging bloat. It simplifies complicated situations which masks places that haven’t actually been accurately mapped. Sadly, it has gone the way of ID in both data mutilation and in cult-like defense. Such a shame, too. It is a fantastic idea that has long ago ballooned into a data bloat and quality destruction tool. Some time ago, I recall seeing push back on a feature request to add a “backrest” quest for benches. I can’t think of how that quest could go wrong but I appreciated seeing the defense of the database’s quality and accuracy. I miss those days.

That’s enough of the negative. Thank you for putting this together. Just the other day I was looking for each editor’s usage percentage. So, you’ve answered a question I had. I am surprised that StreetComplete does not look to have stolen any users form ID or JOSM. I am also surprised that OsmAnd (my favorite navigation app) is a source of more edits than Vespucci. Vespucci is a solid app and deserves far more love.

If you have not done so already, explore JOSM’s “Presets” section. There are a lot of useful tools in “Plugins” and “Tagging Presets”. “Map Paint Styles” can be a world of difference depending on what you’re focusing on. Lastly, after a couple years of mapping with both ID and JOSM, I finally took the time to check out the “filter” plugin. Honestly, I don’t know if I edit without it anymore. Welcome and happy mapping.

According to your chart, MAPS.ME was dying since late 2016 to today. The OSM new user chart indicates a drop of about 6,000, in the latter have of 2021 (tic marks are difficult to match to date). MAPS.ME shows a drop of a few hundred new users in that time. I’m not sold on MAPS.ME being a significant contributor to that decline. I’m more troubled by OSM’s plateauing of monthly new users (slight decline) and stagnant monthly active users (fairly flat) in that same time range. The full history of the project still shows growth (outside of monthly contributors), which is good. Edit per mouth still grows. I am concerned that this trend shows either, each mapper is shouldering more and more of the mapping effort (worrying) or automation/corporations are doing the extra work (troublesome). Thank you for packaging the data.

The wiki entry for “highway=steps” says to add width=* tag to indicate how broad a set of steps are. Therefore, it looks like the expected way a short and broad set of steps would be entered is: A way would be drawn in the center of the stairs The way would go from the top of the steps to the bottom of the steps (or the opposite). The way would be tagged with “highway=steps”, “steps=”, and “width=” Please, avoid mistagging data such as tagging steps as kerbs. Bad data is worse than no data.

mariotomo,

I have been following your saga for almost a year (Mailing list / OSM telegram / OSM diary / a few changeset comments). My heart goes out to you. From what I have seen, you have balanced insistence and civility for much longer than a person can be expected too. I must soften that statement by mentioning that I have not been involved and do not know the full actions of all involved. So, maybe my praise is misplaced. Only you know the truth.

I have seen the DWG publicly interact with OSM contributors, whom are part of some disagreement. I have yet to feel that the DWG has made the correct decision in any of the situations that I have witnessed. In other situations (vandalism, reverting undiscussed mass edits, spam, etc.) I support their actions. Unfortunately, I feel you have become the focus of the DWG’s “solution” because you are the easier resolution to this conflict. Again, I only know what I have seen so I might be wildly off in my interpenetration.

As for advice in regards to your frustration (if you can do the following): Stop looking at change sets to reduce your own frustration. Stop interacting with the community to avoid getting banned from the OSM project for unjust reasons. Fix what is incorrect when you come across it so that you can feel proud about continuing to improve the quality of OSM data. Don’t change edits back if another contributor changes your work to avoid edit wars, which might bring the ire of the DWG and a possible ban. I attempt to do all of these things myself even though I’d love to be very active with the community. I personally value the altruistic nature of the OSM project (and FOSS projects in general) more than I value the personal interaction with the community. I guess, you might need to think about what you value the most about your contributions to OSM and see what you can avoid doing while still feeling fulfilled. I think it is unfair that you have found yourself in this position but sadly life is not always fair.

I am sorry you have been going through this. Please, be well and happy mapping.

That is very interesting. Thank you.

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Das ist sehr interessant. Dankeschön.

SeverinGeo, I share these same thoughts and concerns (plus more). Thank you for posting.

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SeverinGeo, je partage ces mêmes pensées et préoccupations (et plus encore). Merci d’avoir posté.